Carl Peterson is Still a Liability Until Proven Otherwise
So much for positivity. I’ve made it very clear that I loved the way the Chiefs drafted in 2008. I am a huge supporter of the direction that Herm Edwards and Bill Kuharich are taking the Chiefs in. Whereas many teams like the Jets and the Raiders are splurging on marginal veterans to band-aid leaky holes, the Chiefs are promoting open competition. Love the strategy.
That being said, I still do not trust Carl Peterson one bit to put this franchise over the top. While many see the shift to the youth movement as a testament to the fact that Carl Peterson is changing his ways, I couldn’t disagree more. Peterson is still the same arrogant S.O.B.; he has just been lucky that his mistakes have not come to bite him… yet.
Problem #1: Signing First Round Picks
Ryan Sims’ Dad made a pretty glaring accusation a few months ago that Carl Peterson has a history of low-balling first round picks. He claims that at the NFL Draft, many NFL teams warned him about Peterson’s ways. While so many were quick to brush this off and claim that because Sims was fat and lousy as a player, he has no credibility. I, on the other hand, became concerned as to whether there is any truth to his comment. Quietly, Peterson has racked up a very lousy recent track record of bringing first round picks to camp on time. Dwayne Bowe was a holdout. Tamba Hali made it to camp literally hours before camp started. Derrick Johnson was a holdout (albeit, a short one). Ryan Sims was a holdout. John Tait was a holdout. Sylvester Morris was a holdout. The only recent player to make it to camp in plenty of time was Larry Johnson.
The accusation would be a lot easier to deny if there wasn’t such a track record behind it. Glenn Dorsey needs to be in camp so he can stay healthy (holdouts become greater injury risks). Albert absolutely must make camp in time because he has a lot to learn if he plans to be a starting tackle this season. It is absolutely, positively imperative that the Chiefs bring their draft picks to camp on time. If Peterson can get not one, but two first rounders to camp on time, then perhaps we can claim that Peterson has started to change.
Problem #2: Landing Marquee Free Agents
Carl Peterson will have you believe that he’s a terrific negotiator. I have yet to see much proof that he is. His negotiating tactic works when you have a lot of time to negotiate. He’s been able to lock down some of his own players like LJ because they were already under contract and they were negotiating an extension. The word from both the LJ and Allen camp is that Peterson submitted a lowball offer and then refused to talk to the other side until the agent lowered their offer.
Peterson has never been successful negotiating contracts with the “first wave.” For a long time, I believed this was intentional. The more I evaluate his tactics, the more I begin to wonder if he’s just incapable of negotiating a contract with an agent that has more leverage than he has. Isn’t it interesting that most free agents who come to Kansas City weren’t courted by anybody else? Isn’t it interesting that the Chiefs have lost so many battles with free agents who are courted by other teams (i.e. Jeremiah Trotter, Troy Vincent, Samari Rolle). And I can’t help but wonder if there’s a compelling reason for why Jeff Faine and Josh Brown didn’t even bother to fly into Kansas City.
While I haven’t been in the negotiation room, the overwhelming feeling is that Peterson likes to lowball. That sometimes works when you negotiate with your own players and you have lots of time to lock down a deal; it does not work when it comes to landing free agents. This hardline tactic also drove both John Tait and Jared Allen out of Kansas City.
The Chiefs, at some point, are going to have to bring in top-flight free agents to put them over the top. I have seen very little from Peterson to suggest that he’s capable of doing such. The problem is when you disguise shortcomings as strategy. Is Peterson purposely targeting second-wave free agents only, hoping to find value players at an affordable price? Or is Peterson only targeting players that won’t be put off by his hardball tactics? I’m beginning to think it’s the former.
Problem #3: Keeping the players happy
This is new to Carl Peterson and I’m not sure what the cause is. For some reason, Peterson has lost complete respect from his players. There seems to be a huge divide between the players and the front office. Kyle Turley ranted on Sirius NFL Radio shortly after his retirement about the front office’s tactics. Greg Wesley accused the Chiefs of lying to him about their intention to release him. Trent Green was clearly not happy about the way he was let loose (and long-revered Chief Will Shields chimed in on Sirius NFL Radio that he concurred). The Chiefs are having a hard enough time attracting marquee talent in Kansas City; they can’t afford to lose players because they can’t put up with the management.
The Chiefs came out okay on the Jared Allen deal. But don’t give Carl Peterson a free pass. The truth is, his notoriously hardline negotiation style obviously set something off in Allen to the point that Allen flat-out refused to negotiate with Peterson. The Chiefs were lucky that Minnesota was willing to give up premium draft picks for Allen and for that, the Chiefs were considered geniuses. I would claim that the Chiefs were merely lucky to cover up their mistake. If no team offered decent trade compensation and Allen never agreed to a long-term contract to the Chiefs, I wonder how much Kansas City fans would appreciate Peterson’s tactics.
Closing Thoughts
It’s interesting how defensive fans have become in Carl Peterson. While I don’t subscribe to the Jason Whitlock argument that Peterson can do no right, I also find it hard to believe that there is so much support for a General Manager who has notoriously built underachieving teams. Fool me once, shame on Carl Peterson. Fool me twenty times, shame on me.
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19 Responses to “Carl Peterson is Still a Liability Until Proven Otherwise”
June 5th, 2008 at 8:48 pm
I’m not sure that there’s really been overwhelming support for Peterson lately. I think that the draft was just such a refreshing change that people aren’t hating on him nearly as much as usual.
I’m not sure we have anything to worry about here, though. Isn’t this year or next year the last of his contract? I really don’t think Clark will re-sign him and I don’t think Peterson will allow himself to be fired/demoted. I think he’ll go ahead and step down before anything happens to avoid the embarassment.
Jon, great point about the first round picks being signed. That is of the utmost importance right now. If they aren’t it could affect this season (and future ones) in a huge way. That being said, I think that Clark and Herm realize it and will be putting the pressure on CP to get the deals done in a timely manner. Also, we’d be ignorant to think that Chan and Gun don’t have a little lobbying power. You know the shit will hit the fan with those two if their boys aren’t signed on time. Therefore, I’m confident that the King will get both accomplished, probably just barely in time for training camp.
As far as Carl changing his ways, I disagree. I think that Lamar gave him nearly complete control because he had a lot of trust (whether misguided or not) in Peterson’s ability as a GM. My impression is that now Clark has seen the need for change and realized the sanity of Herm’s plan and that he TOLD Peterson how it was going to be implemented. I imagine it’s a lot more of a lack of decision-making responsibility on CP’s part than an actual change of business tactics.
Bottom line: The franchise has finally committed to change. This includes a massive renovation of the stadium, players, and coaching staff. Why not the GM too? He may have done some good things for us in the early years, but he’s past his prime. Ownership has finally realized that the old ways didn’t work. I think that eventually, Carl will be scraped off with the rest of the lingering barnacles of the team like Kendrell Bell, Ty Law, and Kyle Turley. It’s time for this ship to sail in a different direction and the whole Chiefs Nation knows it.
Plain and simple - he’s one of the only holdovers from the pre-Herm era and we’ve seen the kind of job security those guys have. He’s really the only reminder that we have left of the last few decades of mediocrity.
One thing is for sure - it will be WEIRD when he’s gone. Who’s everybody going to bitch about? Will Jabba just shrivel up and die?
June 6th, 2008 at 6:28 am
Having been a CP hater for the past several seasons, this article is throwing out some red meat on the table for this dog. Everything stated in the article is, in my opinion, accurate.
There’s one thing to be said for being a hard nosed but fair negotiator and another for being an arrogant and condescending prick who consistently gives the appearance of a King ruling over his fiefdom. The ’serfs’ or the players and their agents, have seen through CP’s act and yet there he sits, high above it all on his throne waiting for the next group to kneel at his throne.
I’m still hopeful that the young Clark Hunt will step in, force the King’s hand and make him get this landmark draft class all signed and to camp on time. If that fails to happen, then we’ll all know that the power still rests with CP and that’s far from a good thing.
June 6th, 2008 at 8:23 am
Great points, Ron. I have noticed a major shift in power and I think Clark Hunt is largely the reason for that. A few things to keep in mind: Carl Peterson has had a track record of doing exactly what his coaches want, sometimes to the fault. So his pure adoption of Herm’s strategy is not overly surprising. To his credit, he’s very, very good at listening to his coaches and getting them what they want.
The successful draft, I would concede, was largely the result of Bill Kuharich replacing Lynn Stiles. Peterson was a part of that, especially in regards to acquiring the draft picks, but Kuharich listens to his scouts whereas Lynn Stiles typically relied on his network of buddies to scout. That, to me, is the biggest difference between the Chiefs of now and the Chiefs of then, and I think that’s somewhat unrelated to Carl Peterson.
But all that aside, for as much positive as we’ve seen, there are too many warning signs that, to me, suggest that we’ll never make it to that very next step. The Chiefs will need to bring draft picks on time. The Chiefs will, 2-3 years down the road, need to pick up some marquee free agents to put the Chiefs over the top. The Chiefs will need to keep their player happy and keep them in Kansas City. With the way the LJ and Allen negotiations went, I’m not confident we can.
June 6th, 2008 at 8:50 am
Don’t you mean “the latter” (second choice)?
June 6th, 2008 at 8:59 am
Excellent article, by the way. I came to the conclusion after watching “Hard Knocks” that Peterson, while I think he honestly means well for the Chiefs, has a lot of trouble in objectively analyzing talent and fair market value in contracts (let’s also not forget that he gave a 28 year old running back on a bad team a huge contract as well out of desperation the year after the team overused him…a move that has so far not been helpful to the team). He also came off as somebody who doesn’t do a very good job of learning from his mistakes and adapting to changing circumstances. Basically, Peterson’s old and inflexible and I think at this point he has to be considered a major weakness on the team and not an asset. Fortunately, it seems that Herm and Kuharich are capable talent evaluators (although how well they do in Peterson’s role has yet to be determined) so we’re not in bad shape when Peterson leaves…hopefully after this season, or when his contract is up in two years (at the latest).
June 6th, 2008 at 9:03 am
I said this after the wonderful draft we had, that only CP could mess this up and he probably will.
June 6th, 2008 at 9:52 am
I think Carl gets a bad rap because he takes the heat without complaining for team fiscal policies that are not entirely of his making - and I think most of the criticism he’s getting is based on his performance prior to the current CBA. The fact of the matter is KC is a small market team and they simply do not have the revenue streams that allow them to take the risks some other teams in the league take.
And I dont think you can compare Minnesota to KC because the situation in MN with their proposed new stadium is forcing their mgmt to win now in order to grease the skids in the hallowed halls of government there in order to get a bond levy passed to help build the stadium.
The truth is King Carl has managed to field competitive entertaining teams that are able to compete with larger market teams regardless of coaching philosophy (offensive/Vermeil vice defensive/Schottenheimer) and he’s done it with a small market team’s financial limitations.
Is the King having to learn some new tricks now that the new TV contract and CBA are forcing teams to spend 60% of the TV money on salaries? Sure he is! But I suspect he will learn quickly and be more effective with desireable free agents once the team is out of the cellar.
Truthfully, I think we’re damn lucky to have such a talented man running the show. There isn’t a person on the face of the planet who can do that job without getting complaints from players. But I haven’t forgotten the25 years of losing that preceded King Carl’s tenure with the Chiefs and I’m in no hurry to go back. If the team needs two or even three years of sub-500 teams to get us back to where we belong, that’d fine with me. King Carl has EARNED the chance to get it right.
June 6th, 2008 at 10:12 am
CurtMerzFan,
“The fact of the matter is KC is a small market team and they simply do not have the revenue streams that allow them to take the risks some other teams in the league take.”
I’m sorry, but that’s crap. The NFL’s got a hard salary cap designed to keep all teams competitive. Buffalo is a small-market team…much smaller than KC market…and they went to four consecutive Super Bowls during the “free agency no salary cap” period. How many did Carl Peterson go to during that time? How many did he go to when we got the hard cap? How many did he go to before the NFL got free agency…when players were stuck with their same team and much less leverage?
The answer to all of those question is “zero”.
In fact, it’s been well over a decade since we last won a playoff game. Want to know why? Go take a look at how much money Peterson’s actually wasted on bad free agent signings and contract extensions. Kendrell Bell, Ty Law, Chester McGlockton to name a few…all big contracts well above fair market value for players that didn’t perform to expectations (all three of which were predictable). Look at the sheer number of draft picks the Chiefs have whiffed on during his tenure…especially high draft picks. Their record is terrible when you contrast it to the rest of the teams in the league. As for the teams he’s assembled, name me one Chiefs team of the last 20 years that didn’t have one easily identifiable fatal flaw. You can’t do it because Peterson has never assembled a complete team…he always leaves a major piece missing.
We were lucky to have Peterson for the first six or seven years of his time here…since then he’s been an albatross around the team’s neck and there are plenty of other GM candidates that have been available for the last 12 years who could have done a better job than he did. Most Peterson fans just choose to pretend there aren’t because they fear change so much that they’re willing to accept mediocrity and failure.
June 6th, 2008 at 4:27 pm
(Regarding the post)
Jon, I agree with all of your points, but would like to add that I think Carl doesn’t know when to adapt his style.
This may possibly be due to his ego, or due to the fact he lacks the ability to recognize the nature of a situation and adjust his tactics. Simply, he lacks situational awareness.
He seems to play hardball no matter the circumstances. He doesn’t ever seem to realize when he is outnumbered or out-leveraged.
If it this is due to ego, then ithis is nothing more than hubris, which by definition is doomed to failure.
If it is nothing more than his inability to recognize the variables of a given situation, then it is borderline incompetence.
June 6th, 2008 at 4:30 pm
CurtMerzFan,
The only thing that hasn’t changed in 20 years is Carl, and the terrible negotiating.
June 6th, 2008 at 8:36 pm
Hmmm UCrawford just a point of reference to the salary cap….
the salary cap in the NFL does not include income from luxury boxes….(although that changed a bit with the agreement two years ago)….the truth of the matter is that dallas makes millions of dollars more than the chiefs with the income of the luxury boxes…..with the new stadium we should be a bit more competitive but still the difference is huge between us and a large market team…
June 6th, 2008 at 8:47 pm
Jon, I have to join in the chorus here and agree with you.
However, you left out several important factors that speak to why the Chiefs haven’t been able to win a playoff game since dinosaurs roamed the earth. Here are some other very important reasons why Carl Peterson is Awful:
1. Carl Peterson is all about loyalty and control rather than excellence, especially when it comes to hiring. He hires people who are loyal to him rather than the best people! Here are two good examples. First, Herm Edwards. He was 4-12! I don’t care if 2 of his quarterbacks went down - you have to be truly awful lose that many. The only reason he had any success in New York was because he was given the keys to a team that Bill Parcells built. Despite Herm’s record, Carl hired him because they go way back. Second our current offensive line coach, Bob Bicknell. What, you’ve never heard of him? Why not, his last job before the Chiefs was at…Temple, as OL coach? Hmm. Why was he hired then? From the Chiefs website: “Bicknell began his NFL Europe coaching career as an offensive line coach with the Frankfurt Galaxy (’98-99). He served on the staff of Chiefs assistant head coach/quarterbacks coach Dick Curl when Curl was the Galaxy head coach…Bicknell was a three-year letterman as a tight end at Boston College when Curl was on staff as the QBs coach.”
2. Carl can’t admit when he’s wrong and keeps bad people in long after they should have been fired. Lin Elliott. Greg Robinson. Mike Solari. Case closed.
3. Not only can Carl not admit when he’s wrong, he tries to will himself into a decision being right, when it’s clearly turning wrong. Here are three very recent examples: First, Brodie Croyle. We’re trying to will the guy into being good. Unfortunately, he probably isn’t. Draft a QB for insurance? Nah. Second, the new guy, Brandon Albert. We don’t have a left tackle, so we’re going to make a guy who’s never played left tackle into one? Good luck. Third, what is all this about moving Boone over to DE? What? Are you kidding me? Our defensive line is all screwed up now.
4. He makes decisions based on money rather than on winning. Example: Rich Gannon. We kept Grbac because we had given him first-string money when everyone in Kansas City could see that Gannon was better. Case CLOSED.
As much as I love the Chiefs, and I love them as much as anyone in Kansas City, between Herm’s appalling in-game management and decisionmaking about players, and Carl’s overall awfulness (see above), I predict that the Chiefs will be a pretty bad team until at least two seasons after they are both gone. Please prove me wrong, Chiefs!
June 8th, 2008 at 10:06 pm
Well as a Raiders fan i hope you dont sign your rookies until after training camp(like us last season)… But if Dorsey or Albert aren’t in camp on time they most likely wont start so they wont have an effect until later in the season or next season… not that it matters cause you’ll suck anyways… lol… Also its not all Peterson’s fault that you cant sign any marquee free agents players wanna win… Why would they go to KC? duh! Befoe all you BITCH KC fans start making smart remarks at least Al Davis is willing to take the rubber bands off his walet and bring in good players… So we can go back to our winnig ways… You IDIOTS once released Rich Gannon and now you traded away the player that actually made your defense(team) competive Jarred Allen because Peterson didnt wanna like him because he wantd more money… But no need to worry Peterson and Edwards drafted someone elses players because i highly doubt they’ll last more than two more seasons…
GO RAIDERS!!!
June 10th, 2008 at 2:21 pm
pat T
Excellent comments coming from the fan of a team that hasn’t won more than 5 games in a season since 2002. Even worse, the Chiefs (and everyone else in the AFC West) have basically owned the Raiders during that span. We’ll see how they do this year, but I wouldn’t get too fired up about their chances given all the new overpaid marginal talent Crazy Al purchased at the Free Agent swap meet this offseason. That team likely won’t gel before he bankrupts the organization or fire the coach…again.
June 10th, 2008 at 6:05 pm
Hey Brian when you say OWNED it usally mean losing by 10 points or more… At least thats my definition of being owned, Therefore that means your squad has owned twice since 2002 every game has been close… And im glad you said you’ve ownED us… its past tense… last season we split the series… And let me just say this its better having overpaid players than having crappy players and trading away my best player because im to cheap to pay him(Carl Petrson)… And i assure you they will gel just in time to SMASH your squad… The only team that still holds bragging rights over us in our divison are the San Diego Chargers, so dont talk all this shit because every Raider vs. Chiefs game is close and you know it… Dumbass Chiefs fans…
GO RAIDERS!!!
June 10th, 2008 at 6:08 pm
Excuse me Brian were talking about the present here, if anything last time the Raiders and Chiefs met we beat them… Rightttt??? The only team in the AFC West that holds bragging rights are the San Diego Chargers…
GO RAIDERS!!!
June 11th, 2008 at 1:44 pm
We have made a CHOICE to get younger, and not soley because we’re cheap, although economics have also played a role due in part to our stadium renovations. We’re building a team from the ground up that will produce for years to come, not just a couple of seasons. That’s what the Chargers did. The players are not crappy, they are young and unproven, just like your starting QB, and given the lack of starts for your QB, I would highly doubt your going to SMASH anybody. Oh, and by the way, if we are talking present tense, then the Raiders haven’t proven anything…it’s July. They still need to get through training camp without their chronic dysfunction getting in the way of fielding a successful team. Who are the dumbasses?!
June 11th, 2008 at 4:39 pm
No, no, no! You got it all wrong Brian you had NO CHOICE… And shut the fuck up with that economics crap… Carl Peterson is cheap and your fellow fans know it… I dont see dumbasses, I see a dumbass he’s right above me :)… I’ve never said we would SMASH people, i said we would SMASH your squad… And wtf are you talking about the Chargers i dont like them but what are you talking about their team is pretty young overall… And i know we havent proven anything, but at least we know we have a SOLID running game… And you have… hmmm hold on im thinking… never mind the only thing you have is a crappy team with a bunch of unproven rookies and half of them dont even know what positions they’ll be playing come September… Your team will go as far as LJ goes… And he wont go to far and i assure you that… But not to worry young grasshopper Herm Edwards and Carl Peterson drafted someone elses players this offseason… And dont try to play it off Carl Peterson is cheap the guy probably hides his money in his pillow cases and mattresses… He let go of your BEST PLAYER in Jarred Allen… Ill say it again Dumbasses
GO RAIDERS!!!
June 14th, 2008 at 10:57 am
I heard yesterday from a very reliable source that Carl is going to Miami. I couldn’t be happier!
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