Update On Al Wilson; Other Notes
Well this quiet week is finally heating up. I’ve been busy lately and haven’t had a chance to update you guys on Giants rumors and news lately but Dan has been doing a great job of getting the information out. Well this is what I have as of right now, cell phone has been pretty quiet lately, starting with the Broncos and Giants trade talks:
- The Broncos spoke about Justin Tuck and draft picks in the Dre Bly trade talks. Now Tuck is the centerpiece of the Wilson talk. Apparently the Broncos opening offer was to swap first rounders, the Giants 4th rd pick, and Justin Tuck. The Giants want the offer toned down, but the two sides aren’t far apart like they were in the Bly talks.
- Vonta Leach is likely to become a Giant. The Texans love him, but think the Giants are overpaying for a fullback.
- R.W McQuarters is indeed on the trading block. The Giants want to keep Madison as the veteran presence in the secondary and give Webster one more shot to live up to the expectations. They are set on drafting a defensive back on day 1.
- Names I’ve heard linked to the Giants with regards to the first round of the draft (and no not through those ridiculous Mel Kiper and co. “draft guru’s”):
LBs: Paul Posluszny, Patrick Willis, Lawerence Timmons
CBs: Chris Houston, Darelle Revis, Eric Wright
OT: Levi Brown, Joe Staley
Apparently, Reese really likes Levi Brown, but feels this is the draft to build up the defense and can afford to pass on him with Diehl as a solid option at LT
We’ll see what happens.
Update
- The Philadelphia Eagles are trying everything they can to prevent the Giants from acquiring Wilson. They have contacted the Broncos about Wilson multiple times. If nothing else, they want to drive up the price for New York.
The Lions are starting to call back also, even after telling the Broncos they were out of the run for Wilson, but they are on the outside looking in.
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139 Responses to “Update On Al Wilson; Other Notes”
March 22nd, 2007 at 11:27 pm
Makes a lot of sense, I am glad they agree with me, lol.
Seriously though, The broncos want that DE and shanahan is known for getting the best of the trades. I hope Reese realizes that the giants hold the leverage. A #6 makes more sense, Wilson will be 30 and was hurt last season. What happened to getting younger and healthier?
March 22nd, 2007 at 11:29 pm
Hazem,
What are they hoping to get for RW?
March 22nd, 2007 at 11:36 pm
Rouss - No word of that, but my guess would be a second day pick - 5th rounder probably.
March 22nd, 2007 at 11:53 pm
I’m a really big Tuck fan, I like the guy. I think he’d be a tremendous DE (yes, you heard me on that). He gets great penetration and seems to get the best of blockers most of the time, and he’s really strong.
However, if it were like…swapping 1st round & giving Tuck for Wilson, I think I’d agree to that. But only because Tuck wouldn’t be a starter for us, and Wilson would. Therefore we’d be filling the bigger hole.
I do NOT want to give a 4th rounder AND Tuck though…maybe something like swapping our 1st and 3rd round picks with Denver? That way we don’t “lose” a pick, but Denver gets to move up a little.
So it would look like this …
Denver gets:
1.) Justin Tuck
2.) #20 pick (instead of #21)
3.) #81 pick (instead of #86 pick)
——
Giants get:
1.) Al Wilson
2.) #21 pick (instead of #20)
3.) #86 pick (instead of #81)
I just don’t want to give up draft picks … :\
March 22nd, 2007 at 11:57 pm
Billy - I like your proposal, but I think the Broncos would prefer the extra pick over a third round swap that only moves them up a few spots.
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:00 am
None of this will happen. The Giants want Briggs and are waiting to get him so he can knock Rex on his ass next time we play da bears.
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:04 am
Hazem,
The leak came from the Giants according to the reports, why would the Giants want to leak this?
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:05 am
So they make da bears think they don’t need Briggs
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:05 am
Its all “STRATEGERY”
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:08 am
Rouss - Reese has always been open about trade talks. We saw it when he spoke about McGahee, and we heard leaks about Briggs and Bly.
These talks though, aren’t just in the preliminary stages, the Giants and Broncos are actually pretty close, and when that happens more and more people within an organization start shelling out whispers to the media.
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:10 am
How about William Joseph and a 5RD pick for Al Wilson? I think thats a good trade. The Broncos could use another DT/DE and a 5RD pick isnt too much for us to package with him.
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:13 am
Hazem-Any thoughts about a monster trade where the the Giants get Wilson and Bly and the Broncos get RW and Tuck and a pick?
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:13 am
gianthinker-
I like that. You should be GM not Reese
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:14 am
gianthinker - The Broncos wouldn’t do more than chuckle at that offer. Not a chance.
Wilson is a pro-bowl linebacker that could instantly improve a defense. They would never want a first round bust that’s nothing more than average and a 5th rounder.
Tuck has a lot of potential, and the Broncos need a young, true DE with upside.
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:14 am
William Joseph and a 5RD pick for Al Wilson. gianthinker is on to something
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:15 am
The Broncos could also use a DT that isn’t a total waste of a roster spot…
An aging CB and a DE, and a pick, for Wilson AND Bly? That’s a madden trade…
Hell, all the rumors of Bly to the Redskins earlier involved the Skins’ FIRST round pick which is a top 10 pick. Bly has value, even more so to them since they NEED him (remember that Darrent is gone thanks to some asshole with a gun?)…
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:15 am
How come Haz is so smart?
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:17 am
giantthinker - Lol that would be insane. NFL blockbuster. I wish the Giants would be able to acquire both, but that’s obviously not very likely at all.
Hypothetically,
I’d give RW since the Giants want him moved anyway, Tuck, a swap of first rounders since it’s only one slot, and a third round pick for Bly and Wilson.
The third round pick might be a steep price but I think to acquire 2 established, very talented players and add them to a defense with monster defensive ends and a real good middle linebacker would take the Giants a long way.
Again though, not going to happen.
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:18 am
I would give them a 5th and Tuck without swapping first rounders. I think tuck is the key to the trade.
I would not swap because if Nelson is there shouldn’t we take him? that’s who they want at #20
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:21 am
Hey we had to lose a lot of games to get that #20 spot and we shouldn’t give it up. Take Puz at 20 and forget this trade.
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:21 am
Rouss - You’re right about Tuck being the key to the deal but if the Broncos don’t get what they want with regards to picks they won’t pull the trigger because this years draft is loaded with talent at DE, and other teams are interested in Wilson, it’s not just the Giants.
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:24 am
Take one of these guys at 20 and forget the trade:
LBs: Paul Posluszny, Patrick Willis, Lawerence Timmons
CBs: Chris Houston, Darelle Revis, Eric Wright
OT: Levi Brown, Joe Staley
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:25 am
Rick - It’s one spot. The Giants can still get Pos at 21, and if not there are so many other options.
Wilson and Pierce would make this defense formidable instantly in the front 7. Imagine Wilson and Pierce with Pos or Patrick Willis.
Or Chris Houston at corner?
There are so many options for the Giants in the first round, moving down a spot wouldn’t be an issue.
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:26 am
We need a Left Tackle
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:27 am
One spot is okay but not with another 1st day pick. We have a lot of holes to fill
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:28 am
LT OLB CB and more. we can’t trade picks
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:30 am
What are da bears gonna do with Briggs. I’d rather have Briggs. Work this trade out for him.
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:31 am
Rick - We can afford to let go of a pick. You think a 4th round pick would really provide a impact player this year?
Maybe, but Wilson is a pro-bowl linebacker with 5-6 years left at a high level. I’d let go of a 4th rd pick for that.
This team needs to take advantage of this weak NFC, and get some impact players for a playoff run now.
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:33 am
Rick - If you don’t want to lose picks you shouldn’t even be thinking about Briggs. The bears want at least 3 picks for him, and he’s not much better than WIlson, yet would come at twice the price.
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:33 am
He’s 30. What round did the Saints get MarquesColston in?
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:33 am
Hazem,
We somehwat agree but the lions have better picks than the Giants and yet they are out of the discussions(According to everything I read), why? they don’t have who the Broncos want, a young DE stud. If it were just picks, the broncos would still be talking with the lions.So the Giants do have some leverage.
There are many good players can be had in the 4th. That’s why I hate to part with it.
How Reese pulls off this trade will tell a lot about his skills especialy with Shanahan involved.
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:34 am
I would rather lose a pick on Briggs and they won’t get 3 picks when he holds out. Give THEM Tuck and a 3rd rounded. We should make a move for Ian Scott too
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:35 am
Get off the damn Briggs bandwagon. The guy will wind up playing cus he’ll want his $$. Do you honestly think a LB is going to risk sitting out an entire year? Do you realize how long it’d take to come back and be able to perform, because it takes a while to get used to the speed of the NFL. If he sits out a year it’ll be like he’s a rookie in terms of his intangibles. The Bears will drop his pricetag a little bit, but at this time Briggs is WAYYY too expensive.
Plus why would you want him if we can basically get the same player, impact wise? Wilson would give us a huge increase over what we have….and would still cost a lot less than Briggs.
To get Briggs it’d probably cost a 1st and 3rd round pick, and that’s not swapping a 1st rounder, that’s giving them our 1st rounder. At least in this case we’d be keeping our 1st round pick, which is the important thing.
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:37 am
Hazem,
we’re more on the same page than I thought. I just hate to part with 1st day picks, that’s where I agree with Reese.
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:37 am
Rick, the Bears don’t NEED Tuck. Geez, do you even look at what a team needs. You can’t just throw a player out for another. You have to see how they’d fit or if they’re even needed.
The Broncos currently don’t have a DE. That means they need 1, and they want a young guy with some experience, and a very high ceiling. That’s why Tuck fits the mold. Tuck is the kind of guy who can help them now and in the future. Who knows what a Lions’ draft pick would do…not even player performs well right away in the NFL. At least Tuck’s performed well in his limited action.
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:38 am
Briggs is a lot younger than Wilson. We’d get more years out of him.
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:40 am
Rick - Briggs won’t go for a third rounder and Tuck. Not even in Madden dude.
Rouss - Good points, like I said you are right about Tuck as the center piece, and the Lions don’t have that young DE, but the Broncos also want a extra pick. The Lions weren’t going to give up too much for Wilson, so what they were offering, although better picks, wasn’t better than the Giants package.
I’m anxious to see what Reese can do with Shanahan also.
If he can do Wilson for Tuck and just the first round pick swap that would be very impressive.
I still think he’ll have to throw in a second day pick though. Hopefully not.
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:41 am
I agree, give them Tuck. I just hate to part with an early pick for a 30 yr old player. What happened to Younger and Healthier?
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:42 am
I hate to tell you this but when Urlacher was injured, Briggs did not play well, he benefits from all the attention that Urlacher gets. He is still a very good and young lb but he is a little overhyped and is definitely not worth a first round pick in my view.
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:44 am
My problem with wilson is his age and we can give up a 1st day pick. A swap is okay.
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:45 am
Rick - They aren’t parting with an early pick. They would just be moving a single spot down in the first round, and giving up a second day pick.
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:46 am
Ok the Briggs trade is not going to happen. He want BIG $$ and the bears are going to demand 2 pics this yr and 1 next. ID rather give up tuck and a 4th for a player similar to briggs(wilson).
I’m pretty sure I would freak out if we traded for Wilson and Bly!
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:47 am
That’s okay just nothing more. Lets see what Reese can do.
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:57 am
Remember that was the broncos opening Salvo, we only know that the Giants asked for the price to be toned down. This where Reese earns his pay check.
On Bly, correct me if I am wrong Hazem, but back then the Broncos wanted a first round pick for him? I doubt they would settle for #3, but I would definitely do it
Wilson and Bly for a #1 swap + Tuck + #3 and 4.
March 23rd, 2007 at 1:02 am
Rouss - From what I heard the Broncos asked for a 2 and a 4 from the Giants for Bly.
March 23rd, 2007 at 1:08 am
Thanks Hazem,
So they are closer than I thought.
Suddenly the Giants are very competitive if it goes down. They would still have a 1 and 2 to get LT and DT. Not a bad turn of events.
Reese would instantly jump to hero status, lol
March 23rd, 2007 at 1:22 am
Rouss - You’re right the Giants D would improve instantly upon the arrival of wilson. But even if it does go down, I can still see the Giants going with a LB or CB in the first round, there’s a lot of guys like they like, and I don’t see them drafting a DT on the first day.
March 23rd, 2007 at 1:26 am
I don’t think they would still be picking a CB if Bly is part of the deal, would they?
March 23rd, 2007 at 1:43 am
sorry I’m tired and don’t have time to read everyone’s posts to catch up…but is Bly being a part of the deal actually a rumor? or just high hopes? Al Wilson would be a great pick up…better than Briggs imo. pull the trigger on this
March 23rd, 2007 at 1:43 am
Haz- you read my mind with your blockbuster suggestion (RW, Tuck, 3rd round, and swap 1st for their 1st, bly, and wilson). that would be a best case scenario, but highly unlikely considering the amount of action in that. However, we’ve gotta get this deal done for Wilson. The offer we rejected is one that I would have celebrated had it went through. Wilson is a FIVE time pro bowler. Yeah he’s 29, but for linebackers that usually constitutes the prime of their career…check out Adalius Thomas. If we could sweeten the deal for ourselves a bit, even a 5th rounder instead of a 4th that’d be great.
The reality is though that we don’t need Tuck, as good as I think he will be, our DE’s for the present and future are set…he’s dead weight at this point and using him to acquire a superstar like Wilson is brilliant.
The swap of the first rounder is ultimately inconsequential…we have enough needs that whoever they pick we can just go with a different position. Thus, we’re really just giving them a player we don’t need and a 4th rounder for a bonafide All-Pro who has been the leader of an excellent defense (no one scored more than 10 points on them for their first six games).
My point is…we have to get this done, one way or another.
March 23rd, 2007 at 1:48 am
Reese better insist on a physical, I found this burried in a rocky mountain article on the rumor:
“Wilson, who turns 30 in June, had a tough year physically last season with neck, back and thumb problems that affected his play but he still ended up leading the team in tackles with 113. “
March 23rd, 2007 at 1:53 am
to add to my “old but still awesome linebacker list”:
zach thomas
derrick brooks
ray lewis
keith bullock
donnie edwards
london fletcher
tedy bruschi
willie mcginnest (spelling)
the list goes on…
the point is that with a 29 year old perennial pro bowl linebacker, to say age is a major negative factor is to ignore clear evidence to the contrary
March 23rd, 2007 at 1:54 am
Do the trade as is, minus the first round picks.
Tuck and a fourth round pick is what it really is.
Tell Denver to forget the first round swap, and we have a deal.
George Vreeland Hill
March 23rd, 2007 at 1:56 am
The Broncos must be on crack, cause there is no way I give up Tuck and a pick for Wilson. We still have to pay Wilson and Tuck is still on his rookie deal. We should be compensated for taking over his salary. We should swap picks and give them Tuck for Wilson and one of they’re 3rd round picks (70th perferrably). Why would we give them an extra pick to move up a spot when it should be the other way around. We need help at the LB position but we’re not stupid. I hope.
March 23rd, 2007 at 1:58 am
eh, i’d rather play hardball on changing the 4th rounder to something else…but once again, i’d still take it. not doing this would make me sick!
March 23rd, 2007 at 2:01 am
Some of you guys have overinflated values of draft picks and our own players. George, why NOT swap first rounders? Do you know that the Denver has the 21st pick in the NFL Draft? We have the 20th. We move down a single, solitary spot. Considering the Broncos needs are DEs (which we provide them with Justin Tuck) and WRs, which do not interfere with our needs, is a swap that bad? Its insignificant.
4th round picks and beyond are not all that valuable, either. Of course, you do not take up Washington’s approach and trade your entire draft away, but parting with a 4th or 5th rounder is not painful. Everyone points to late round contributors (ranging from Cofield to Colston to Brady) but those people never look at how many flops, duds, and absolute jokes that get drafted there.
March 23rd, 2007 at 2:10 am
Um Derek, Tuck is an unproven talent who just missed a whole season off injury at the one position where we’re stacked. Wilson is a 5 time pro bowler! yeah we pick up his contract but its for 5 million this year. that’s a good amount, but look at what adalius thomas got this year, i believe a hell of a lot more…he’s 32 and hasn’t had the career wilson has or the future wilson does. you roll the dice on a 4th rounder and a player we plain don’t need (tuck)…i’m taking the all-pro. the swap of a pick is almost meaningless…they wouldn’t need what we’d need (CB, they got two of the best in the game).
March 23rd, 2007 at 2:10 am
I’ll rather keep my 4th or 5th rounder and trust my scouts to do their jobs with the possibility of finding a diamond in the rough rather than just giving it away to move DOWN in the draft. Now if they want our 4th or 5th and are willing to part with that 70th pick(they have 2 3rd rounders) I’d do it. Other than that the deal is BS.
March 23rd, 2007 at 2:10 am
Kyle,
The only problem i have with dealing #4 is you can get good value, Tim Shaw for instance or even Mason Crosby the K.
Hazem is reporting that the Giants have already asked the price to be toned down, so it sounds like swap #1’s + #5 + Tuck.
Unless they listen to Hazem and thrown in a #3 and RW for Bly.
March 23rd, 2007 at 2:20 am
You guys are missing the point. We don’t need what they want at 21 either (WR or DE) so we are basically swapping players. Even though he’s only making 5 million next year, which isn’t chump change we are also giving them cap relief which they are obviously looking for or we wouldn’t be discussing this deal. They are trying to take advantage of Reese as a 1st year GM and our needs for LB’s. If we give them a 4th or 5th, they need to give up that 3rd or just swap players and picks. If not call it a day and show them the door. Wilson has already peeked in his career and Tuck is just now scratching the surface. I’m not overvalueing the pick or the player but the NFL is a business and this deal is great for Denver but shaky for us. Remember that 4th round pick is really looked at as the 1st round of the second day. After day one all teams go back to the draft room, re-evaluate the boards and treat it like 1st round day one. Starters are definitely there to be found.
March 23rd, 2007 at 2:22 am
I wouldnt mind sacrificing Tuck even though I like him just for the fact that Kiwi is our #3 DE anyway and we also have Awasom who did well for us so I feel like he could fill our #4 DE spot just fine.
March 23rd, 2007 at 2:24 am
I feel that we are all getting too excited…how close is this to actully getting done? I think I will throw up a little in my mouth if they get this deal done with the Lions or even worse the Eagles. We NEED to stay aggressive in this trade.
March 23rd, 2007 at 2:24 am
rouss, you’d rather have a kicker, an unproven rookie kicker, than an All-Pro linebacker? however, that deal for bly would be sooooo great! that would make us instant contenders again. i’m not saying getting a sweeter deal out of them wouldn’t be nice, just saying this is not bad at all.
derek how does it make sense for them to give us a 3rd for our 4th when the other swap is a measly single spot and Wilson has tons more value than Tuck. wilson is their second best player, where’s tuck rank for us…he’s 4th string? i’m not trying to be really argumentative, but i’m just saying, that doesn’t make much sense.
March 23rd, 2007 at 2:31 am
Jac,
I never said I would rather have a K than a proven LB, I said I would rather keep the #4 and deal the #5.
I think Derek is saying we are underestimating Tuck’s value.
Schaub was just a back up and Atlanta got a great deal for him.
I can understand the argument.
March 23rd, 2007 at 2:32 am
I’ll tell yah what fellas….if nothing else, as long as this trade goes down and we dont over spend in it, Reese will have shown me major skills in trading. He did a monster job with the Droughns trade in my opinion. It was a CashMan like trade (Wright, Sheff). I was suprised because I thought we were in the market for a scat but although Droughns is another bruiser the bottom line is Reese made the team better and the cost was vertually nothing because we would have cut Carter had he stayed anyhow. Even if Droughns becomes our #3 RB because we pick up a scat be will be cheap solid depth. We got a multi 1200 yard rusher for a bust of a pick who shouldnt have gotten another contract last year. Droughns is the best thing Carter ever did for the Giants. If Reese can pull off another trade we wont know if he can sign free agents but we’ll know he can deal with other front offices. Often trades are lop sided so its nice to know your GM is a good negotiator. Usually the good negotiators are the ones who come out on top in trades.
March 23rd, 2007 at 2:35 am
That bottom line is:
1. We are swapping player for player and giving them the cap relief not the other way around.
2. It’s just one spot, but if they weren’t afraid of someone under them moving up on draft day and taking one of their targeted players they wouldn’t be worried about moving up. Atlanta moved up two spots and got 2 2nd rounders. This is a business and we should never sell ourselves short.
I think alot of you are looking at our lack or activity in FA and our glaring need for LB’s and willing to settle for the 1st offer that comes across the table. Remember regardless of the position every pick has value and should be treated accordingly. If they flip our 5th rounder to a Pro-Bowler in the next 3 years you are the same people who’ll be looking at this deal and a washed up Wilson, ready to skin Reese alive.
March 23rd, 2007 at 2:39 am
If you actually read through the comments, Hazeem never suggested that getting Wilson and Bly is a possibility. That was merely hopeful but unfounded speculation by other readers.
The issue on Tuck is that he will struggle to ever bloom as a player in the Giant’s organization; Strahan expects to play two more years at least–especially with his financially burdensome divorce–and Kiwi and Osi are firmly planted above him on the depth chart. He will inevitably leave for greener pastures when he hits free agency in a couple years.
Tuck also does not fit into Spags system if you assume Spags system will be similiar to Jim Johnsons. The Eagles have always played smaller, faster defensive ends to collapse the pocket from the edges and allow the blitz to penetrate the middle right in the quarterback’s face. Hugh Douglas, Jevon Kerse, Kalu, Trent Cole, Derrick Burgess–all pass rushing defensive ends in the Strahan, Kiwi, Osi mold.
Rousse has a good point that dropping from 20-21 won’t hurt us because Denver is unlikely to draft the players we will target. Wilson is a very good linebacker, and while I too hesitate giving up a 4th rounder, I do believe a 5th and a 7th, Tuck, and a swap of first rounders for Wilson would be fair.
March 23rd, 2007 at 2:44 am
Remember if your Denver and you did your homework you looked at who’s underneath you, their needs and how far they’d be willing to reasonably move up in order to beat you out of that pick. That’s where the value of this pick comes into play. It’s a poker match and the one who blinks 1st loses. Now that they’ve shown their hand whatever team that concerns them is now a threat to try and move up if they don’t get this done. We have the leverage with this pick and they have a player they really can’t afford to keep. They can trade him somewhere else but nowhere with a pick over 20.
March 23rd, 2007 at 2:53 am
omg i cant wait to see this man sign to the giants, Tuck and a 4th rounder are u crazy DO IT. the giants are so bad with draft pick we are better off going the Redskins way of offseason. J/P
anyway if u guys think about it we arent loosing much, if this happens our draft picks would look like this CB 1. OT 2. LB.3 DE .5 if Finn moves to TE if not the our number 5 pick would be TE. anyway we should do this trade i dont see any negitive aspect to this, and his age is not an issue
March 23rd, 2007 at 2:57 am
Did you just say Finn to TE???? Wow, someone get this man another drink :^P
March 23rd, 2007 at 3:41 am
Like Joe L said, I did not say the Giants are trying to do anything with Bly.
Readers just asked about it, and I answered that it would be a blockbuster.
Bly is not involved in this deal.
March 23rd, 2007 at 4:38 am
I understand some of you keep saying lets get younger but were not rebuilding here.30 year old middle linebacker is not that old,Linebackers can be effect till at least their mid 30’s.I like this move, Now you have got me a little pumped up. lets see if it goes through..A linebacker core of Wilson and Pierce is pretty Damn good..
March 23rd, 2007 at 5:21 am
I’ve seen plenty of Wilson in action and he amazes me every time - I’d say, he’s right up there in same leauge with Briggs and A. Thomas. Watching Wilson in blue would be SO NICE. But please don’t let a swap/trade deal include Justin Tuck: big mistake if happens. Try offer them Willie Joe, RW and a 4th rounder. I know Broncos have a need at DE, but…….Tuck. Arrgh.
March 23rd, 2007 at 5:51 am
Hard to get something for nothing.
March 23rd, 2007 at 6:08 am
# 74 Krow:
Can’t argue with that…..that’s a fact.
Just hoping Reese pulls some miracle here…
and leaves Tuck out of it.
March 23rd, 2007 at 6:25 am
I certainly hope that the Giants don’t give up any picks for Wilson. Also, Tuck is a valuable backup and with a recent history of injuries and the expected retirement of Strahan next season the Giants will need the depth at DE. Wilson is 30 and has been hurt and according to some has lost a step.
March 23rd, 2007 at 6:33 am
I wish it was Strahan instead of Tuck.
March 23rd, 2007 at 7:31 am
You know, I actually agree with that statement…about Strahan over Tuck…but it WON’T happen. The only reason the Broncos even have Wilson on the block is because of the $$ he makes. Strahan makes more $$, is older, and injury prone as of late. It makes 0 sense for them, but I wouldn’t cry if he were part of it, after the way he acted last year … how he hasn’t played much lately, etc.
March 23rd, 2007 at 7:44 am
We could always pay Strahan’s salary… after we trade him.
March 23rd, 2007 at 7:50 am
Hazem - Who was out fourth round pick last year? Oh Right, Barry Cofield.
Owen Daniels
Brad Smith
Elvis Dumervil
Stephen Gostkowski
Brandon Marshall
Leon Washington
Victor Adeyanju
Jason Avant
Michael Robinson
Ko Simpson
to name a few all had siginifant impacts aswell. So to say we wont get impact from a 4th rounder is silly.
March 23rd, 2007 at 7:54 am
players like Tavarous Bain from Hampton, Yamon Figurs from Fresno State, Lorenzo Booker from FSU, and Marvin White from TCU will be around in the 4th round so that is a valuable pick.
March 23rd, 2007 at 8:04 am
With the giants cap space so low, could they even afford a Bly & Al Wilson pickup?
The Tuck and a late draft pick for Wilson might be a money deal though. Pierce, Wilson and Wilkinson…i’m ok with that situation, especially when you have our defensive line. And that clears the way for a great first round cb pickup, plus we could hold onto RW, who I think is a solid nickel corner.
Its funny how one trade could remove a feeling of doom and gloom.
March 23rd, 2007 at 8:05 am
The biggest hole in the defense is at linebacker. 2 starters were cut and Short is a FA. To trade a backup DE and a 4th round pick for a pro bowl linebacker is a no brainer. I would say a LB is much higher priority on team needs than a possible 4th round scat back and a 3rd string DE. Its a good deal if Reese can pull it off. Maybe he can get that 4th rounder back with a trade of McQuarters to another team.
March 23rd, 2007 at 8:19 am
i dont like this trade at all. why do we trade a potential starting DE who hasnt even come closed to peaking yet for a guy whos in the twilight of his career? i know wilson is a good player, but i just dont think hes worth it. i would rather hold onto the picks and Tuck. I really like him. besides we cant trust strahan to make it through a full season anyway. after that whos our back up DE? awasome? not too mention one of our biggest problems last year was a lack of a rush. and tuck can bring pressure from the DE spot and DT spot on passing situations.
March 23rd, 2007 at 8:52 am
They should totally do this. Tuck has never made it to full potential and has two younger DE ahead of him in the depth chart. We have nothing but DE depth on this team and need a LB. I also think Reese is out of his F#@$ing mind if he doesn’t take Levi Brown if he is available. I mean were we watching the same games after Petigou went down? They couldn’t find anyone to fill that hole now all of a sudden the guy who couldn’t do it last year is our solid LT this year? The beauty of this trade is it would allow us to take Brown when he was available. If Reese is so up on this LB we drafted last year then we really don’t need to be pushing for LBs. That being said, once Brown is off the table, and he will be by the time we pick pull the trigger on another LB. If Reese gets this trade done I will consider free agency a sucess.
March 23rd, 2007 at 8:58 am
Um Nick you may have heard of our DE after Strahan goes down, Kewi remeber him played most of last year was awsome. Anyway we trade Tuck for exactly what you said he hasn’t peaked. He had plenty of time to emerge as a starting DE on this team and just constantly slid down the depth chart. Is it really that crazy to trade a fourth string player for a starter? I know this is hard to believe but you can’t aquire players for nothing. Also how many starters do we have on our team that were taken in the fourth round? I haven’t heard of any. You have to do this trade you are trading a guy who rides the pine all season for a guy who will be out their stoping the run.
March 23rd, 2007 at 9:31 am
why not bly though over wilson? we need the cb and bly is only 25, where as wilson is almost 30?
Is it posible to get both..?
And, btw.. i cant wait for six months from now when our new backfield is just inflicting pain all over the place.. one after another.. :) (see ya tiki)
March 23rd, 2007 at 9:32 am
i guess it doesnt matter who we get, we’d be using the draft to fil the other hole anyways.. i say keep going for youth.. wilson is proven but old…
March 23rd, 2007 at 9:33 am
Guys stop freaking out about Bly being involved in this trade. I brought that up. Not Hazem. Leave him alone. I was joking. Poking fun at the situation. You guys need to chill. I knew it would be a rediculous notion but I didnt know what the whispers about the trade were so I threw it out there for Hazem to shed some knowledge on the subject. But dont flip out about it. I was just joking around. I’m a sarcastic fuck. Besides any blockbuster trade like that would certainly involve a first day pick, Tuck and plobably a restructured Strahan and RW. It wont happen. Its way too much of a huge Madden trade. Just chill. I was kidding around.
March 23rd, 2007 at 9:33 am
I don’t like the sound of this Al Wilson trade. This isn’t to the benefit of the Giants. However I still think Briggs is worth our 1st round pick, we can draft CB in the 2nd round anyways.
March 23rd, 2007 at 9:39 am
And by the way….I wouldnt be too concerned about losing a 4RD pick in this trade. Yes players like my RB favorite Lorenzo Booker should be there in the 4RD but at the same time this is one trade….all we’d be doing is moving our 1RD pick from 20 to 21 and you would have to expect Reese would be very open to moving down via trade with someone like the Bears who have the 31 pick. In any trade down of our 1RD pick we would get at least a 4RD pick if not a 3RD and a 4RD pick in addition. What I’m saying is Reese has to know that he’s in position to easily regain any second day pick he decides to give up, and more.
Dan/Hazem-You agree with my thought process?
March 23rd, 2007 at 9:43 am
how close are we to getting this deal done?… this type of anxiety is not good for me…it cant be. even though im not a denver fan, ive always liked their LBs. they are all athletic fast and can hit. im so excited to be in talks over wilson. he is an intimidator and has that nasty additude that this D needs. it would also be smart to still go after a LB in the 1st round i believe. so again i ask, how close are we to getting this deal done? i just want to make sure cause like most Giant fans, get excited for a possible trade and then suffer from a broken heart
March 23rd, 2007 at 10:04 am
Frank G. - Here’s some more telling information than what you offered. These are our 4th round picks in the last few years, not just one year:
- Cedric Scott
- Jesse Palmer
- Roderick Babers
- Sean Bennett
- Brandon Short
- Reggie Torbor
- Brandon Jacobs
- Barry Cofield
So how many of these guys match up with the impact that Wilson would have on this team Frank?
The chances of landing a player that will give us more than what Al Wilson will in the next 4-5 years is less than 25%. Who besides Brandon Jacobs on that list is a player with pro-bowl potential? 4 of them aren’t even on the team, and Brandon Short is an average linebacker.
EVERYONE ELSE, BLY IS NOT IN THE TRADE. I NEVER SAID HE WAS AND HIM BEING PART OF THE DEAL IS NOT A POSSIBILITY. A READER WAS JUST MAKING A HARMLESS HYPOTHETICAL COMMENT AND I ANSWERED HIM. IT WAS JUST FOR KICKS.
take it easy guys
March 23rd, 2007 at 10:05 am
Bill D no you wouldn’t be able to take a CB in the second round because you would have to trade that for Briggs as well. The Bears want three picks for him a 1st, 2nd, and a 4th this year or next. You may be able to talk them down to two picks but they definately wont let him go for anything less then a 1st and 2nd.
Giant thinker why would we trade down our first rounder to the last pick for a 4th string running back. I know you like Booker and all but what would you want Levi Brown a stud LB or a fourth round pick so you can get a 4th string running back?
Also Sports Illustrated is reporting that Wilson would be moved to Weak side backer and Peirce would stay put. Newark Star Ledger is also reporting this adding that it may be what is holding up the deal.
March 23rd, 2007 at 10:07 am
giantthinker - I do agree, except for the fact that I would much rather stay at 21 than move to somewhere between 29-31 and get a 4th round pick. 10 spots in the first round is worth a lot more than a day 2 pick, if you ask me.
The chances of landing a real good player in the 4th-7th rounds, are no where near the chances of landing impact guys on day 1. Big value difference
March 23rd, 2007 at 10:16 am
Giants fans would quickly fall in love with Wilsons nasty streak. People can say he’s old but he’s just 29. Thats like 4 years more than others we all drewl over. And more importantly in his 9 year career so far he’s never played in less than 15 games. And those 4 years of him being older I personaly cancel out with his 4 ProBowl appearences. I think, if anything, his age is what makes him so attractive to us. Think about it. We want to start Wilkinson so theres one spot. AP had one spot. If we brought in someone for the other spot and draft somone where is that draftee working to get to? He doesnt have a spot. Basically if the guy we brought in was a Briggs or someone like that who is young the guy who we draft is made into a career backup with us or someone we trade in the future. If we bring in someone like Wilson for that spot with his age he will be ready to move out of the way for whoever we draft this year to take over his spot when that picks matured and ready as compaired to a rookie. It works out perfect. Wilson is not only a bridge but he’s an impact player as well. We would fall in love with his speed and smash mouth style. And if we have to give up our 4th string DE to make it happen this trade would be well worth it. I like Tuck very much but when Kiwi was drafted Tuck knew he was in jeopardy. I have been very happy with the production of Awasom as a fill in at LB and DE so its not like we dont have him to fill Tucks #4 depth chart spot. This is just smart. This is getting an older version of Briggs for $2 million a year less. He’s the heart of the Denver defense. Pierce is our heart. If you put them both together maybe we can compete with tandems like Briggs and Urlacher…I wouldnt be suprised if Reese could workout a restructuring of Wilsons deal either.
March 23rd, 2007 at 10:22 am
I HATE TO SEE TUCK GO TO , BUT TO PASS UP THIS DEAL OVER A 4 OR 5 PICK WOULD BE CRAZY . OF COURSE I’M ALL FOR JR GETTING THE BEST DEAL HE CAN .
March 23rd, 2007 at 10:26 am
I think Giants fans have been scared to death to trade picks since the Eli Manning trade.
Everyone is going crazy over a day 2 pick, in which the chances of drafting an impact player are slim.
Sure you can throw out good names, but I guarantee you for every pro bowl 4th/5th round pick you name I can give name you 7 or 8 complete flops in the NFL that were drafted in the 4th round.
March 23rd, 2007 at 10:27 am
Seems a bit too good to be true actually. I’m not holding my breath.
March 23rd, 2007 at 10:31 am
There is a poll online that shows that 66% of Broncos fans are against Wilson being traded.
I think that is very telling about the caliber player and leader he is.
March 23rd, 2007 at 10:36 am
Hazem-Interesting. You dont think they’d get more to move from 21 down? We got a 3 and 4 RD picks last year. I’m sure we could get around the same this year. If not maybe a 4 and 5. I know theres a lot of depth in this draft so second day guys may not be impact stars but they could fill some of our weak spots. I’m not telling you guys (Hazem, Jexxel) we should trade down JUST so we could get Booker. I’m saying IF Reese felt it was SO imortant to have his second day picks he COULD move down a little bit and easily get those picks back. Thats all I’m saying. I was saying that for those who were freaking because we’d be giving up a pick AND Tuck. I’m saying we CAN do that because the pick is easily replaced IF we felt we had to.
—————————–
And Hazem as much as I agree with what you’re saying, and I definatly hear you, that 4RD list isnt as bad as you make it out to be. Cedric Scott, Jesse Palmer, Roderick Babers and Sean Bennett didnt work out for us but Brandon Short, Reggie Torbor, Brandon Jacobs and Barry Cofield werent bad picks. Torbor is the worst of the group and he’ll have one more year to prove himself. Short has played well for us both stints he’s had with us. He just wasnt a ProBowler so I guess he didnt live up…Jacobs and Cofield were very good picks for us. My point is these last four havent been spam dunks but they have been better so thats a positive. We’re getting better at judging later RD talent. If I’m not wrong I think Reese was in on second day activity. So you should look at it in a better way. Historically we havent been great but lately we’ve improved so we CAN get talent there now.
…We need to start taking OL in the 4 + 5 RDs. Then have better success rates out of those RDs than other positions.
March 23rd, 2007 at 10:44 am
giantthinker - I understand what you mean about the 2nd day picks, but to pass up on this deal over a 4th or a 5th round pick would be ludicrous if you ask me.
This is a guy who has 100+ tackles year in and year out, provides leadership, played in more pro bowls than our whole linebacking core in the past 8 years, and would be a rock alongside Antonio Pierce.
Wilson is 29, and Pierce is 28. I don’t hear anyone calling Pierce old. Linebackers can play at a high level until 36 or 37.
March 23rd, 2007 at 10:55 am
Damn dirty Eagles. Always got to be messing with our shit. If I was Reese I would get this done quick before they drive up the price. Also if I was Reese I would make sure to get involved in every signing and trade the Eagles try to do from now on. I say fight fire with fire. I don’t care if it is for a guy we don’t need we should just start blowing smoke up every guys ass the Eagles even talk to. I think they are really mad we took their coach and are trying to get even.
Hazem any update on Ian Scott or how if we are any closer to making this trade. Just like the Giants I finally get to the point where I think I don’t need to monitor FA and they pull me back in.
March 23rd, 2007 at 10:55 am
Hazem I am not knocking the deal at all, I am all for it. But you said we wonuldn’t get impact from a 4th rounder, but there was a bunch last year that had big impacts. Im not saying their impact could equal a possible Al Wilson impact but I am saying that there are impact players in the 4th round.
March 23rd, 2007 at 10:57 am
Frank G - You are right but my point was that the Giants should not hold up the deal over a 4th or 5th round pick, and that the chances of landing a real good player there are slim.
Not a knock on your points, just backing up mine about the deal itself.
March 23rd, 2007 at 10:57 am
Hey we need to do this before the damn dirty Eagles drive up the price. Plus I say from now on we should try to screw with all their deals even if we aren’t interested in the guy they are talking to.
So Hazem any word on how close we are today? Also how about Ian Scott. If we could get those two guys our D would be Ballin’ again.
March 23rd, 2007 at 11:03 am
Jexxel - Nothing on Scott, besides that the Bears are thinking about bringing him back. I’ll update if his name resurfaces with the Giants again, but as of right now the Giants aren’t in the picture.
March 23rd, 2007 at 11:05 am
As for the Wilson situation Jexxel, not much has changed since yesterday. Only that the Eagles are trying to get in the Giants’ way, like they did with Kevin Curtis, who they ended up acquiring themselves.
March 23rd, 2007 at 11:07 am
great…now the deal is gonna be even steeper, if we get it done at all. deals are never perfect, gotta jump when something good comes along and not wait for cinderalla to walk through the door. we’ll see what happens but with the eagles in the game looks like the original deal might be the best we’ll get. Haz, do you think that deal will still be on the table from the broncos side with the eagles and lions coming in now?
PS: the eagles need LB help too, espn projects them as taking one in a very early round (possibly the first), so their interest isn’t just a show. i’d go nuts if they got him instead of us.
March 23rd, 2007 at 11:16 am
JAC - Their interest isn’t just a show at all. But if they can’t acquire Wilson themselves, they will work to drive up the price for the Giants.
The good thing going for the Giants is that they have exactly what the Broncos need. A young, talented DE with upside. With Kiwanuka and Umenyiora, along with Strahan at DE, the Giants can afford to ship Tuck to Denver.
The Eagles will make a strong push, but I think the Broncos want Tuck more than anything the Eagles can offer.
The Lions have the high draft picks, but unless they are willing to part with their second rounder, the Giants are the front runners.
March 23rd, 2007 at 11:18 am
Hazem I AGREE with you. We’re having miscommunitaction or something. I’m AGREEING with you. LOL. I think Tuck and a 4RD for Wilson is a no brainer and a very good move. In addition I was just saying if Reese felt like he wanted to later replace the pick he gave up that he could do that. Thats all. Not that we would go out of our way to do it but depending on who falls to 21 it might be like last year when our highest ranked player can be had at 25 or lower so we might move down further. If we did that we’d definately get second day picks to do so. So I’m not saying we shouldnt do this trade. On the contrary I’ve been saying this is a good trade. I was just saying we could get second day picks later if we chose to.
March 23rd, 2007 at 11:22 am
giantthinker - Lol no I know you do man I’m not arguing with you, just adding to the point I was making in general to everyone.
March 23rd, 2007 at 11:37 am
ok…man i thought we were talking around in circles there for a minute. LOL. You’re funny dude. Ah…so its nice to see Reese looking at LB that can not only tackle but have some extra speed? Wilson will be a definate upgrade if we can get him. It would make me feel a lot better about this offseason. I mean he was named to his 5th ProBowl but couldnt play because of his thumb injury. He can really play. Hazem, great job by the way, have you heard anything on the status of Keith Adams or Ike Reese? I know theres got to be whispers…If we could add Wilson and Adams I would consider our LB core in much better shape then its been in in years.
March 23rd, 2007 at 11:41 am
…And what are the bets? If Wilson does come to us do you think he’ll take over LA’s #55 so everyone who bought his jersey can salvage it and have the name changed?
March 23rd, 2007 at 11:42 am
giantthinker - Thanks for the compliment man. And I’m with you on Wilson, he’s an instant upgrade.
As for Reese and Adams, they’re both depth options, but what I was told about Reese a week ago seems to be bull. Going have to write off some of the people I get my information from.
Once I get something confirmed about either from someone I really trust, I’ll definately update.
March 23rd, 2007 at 11:55 am
Unless the Eagles want to part with their first round pick, they are just playing mind games and Reese better not panick. If the Broncos are too demanding because they are playing the Eagles against the Giants, I am pretty sure he can get good value for Tuck somewhere else.
Hazem, I think tim shaw is going to be a great a strong side LB and can be had in the 4th, that’s why I would try to talk them out of it, but it should not be a deal breaker by any means.
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:33 pm
Hazem, nobody, and i mean NOBODY hates the eagles more than i do. are they really in the running 4 wilson, cause i heard they dropped out of it. and, just your gut feeling, (so guys dont go crazy about it), when do you think a deal will be done
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:35 pm
I think what the Bronco fans and everyone else has forgotten is Reese doesnt overpay. He’s not doing to get dooped for Wilson. He’s not going to overpay at all. He’d rather walk. He’s done it with countless other trades and free agents already this offseason. Bottom line is he’s not going to hurt our team to make this move. I think he’s fully open to just drafting someone but with too many DE’s if he can turn our weakest one into a starting LB he has to look into it. I’m glad I havent heard Kiwi’s name in any discussions yet since I know Denver will try to pry him from us because I hold Tuck in high regaurd as well and its hard enough to part with him. But if we can do this trade for Tuck and a second day pick we have to do it. I hope Reese can pull it off before the weekend. We cant sign anyone till Monday but we can trade for one whenever we want.
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:38 pm
…its nice to know Reese hasnt been sitting around scratching himself while waiting to hear about Leach.
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:38 pm
Damn those igglets!! well, they still overpaid for a #3 receiver! they still have donovan “choker” mcnabb as their qb so to hell with them! now, with that out of my chest..one thing that I think reese has showed us in this crazy FA is his patience and resiliency in negotiations..keep the faith, boys..we may all think that any movement is good for us, but Im slowly getting convinced that reese is a “big” picture kinda guy and not just plug holes in the team with band aids..one thing frustrating is that ian scott news died rather quickly, still no updates?
March 23rd, 2007 at 12:39 pm
…and by the way, I cant see Houston being able to match Leach’s offer sheet after making the Shaub deal. Now they have Shaub’s new big deal and Carr’s bid deal on the books so unless they ship Carr out before Monday I would expect Leach to come to NY. Would you agree Hazem?
March 23rd, 2007 at 1:06 pm
I heard they’re most likely going to cut Carr. I think they have bigger needs than a FB at this moment.
March 23rd, 2007 at 1:35 pm
Terrance T - If a deal isn’t done by tuesday, that will tell that the Giants are no longer the front runners. I expect them to pull the trigger no later than tuesday, and if not, you may see a different team steal Wilson.
Of course, any updates or whispers I can get on the situation will be put up as soon as I get them.
giantthinker - I do agree. Like I said in the article, the Texans love Leach, but think the Giants are overpaying for a fullback.
Boy - Look a few comments up buddy, I answered a question about Scott.
March 23rd, 2007 at 1:43 pm
By the way to answer the questions about Scott, it does not look like many teams are in hot pursuit either. So there must be something else going on there. If he was such a hot commodity, we would have heard some interest/offers, something.
March 23rd, 2007 at 1:49 pm
If Wilson is acquired…and thats a big if…but lets say we do land him, how could we afford him? Im not sure what his slaary is but wasnt it stated last week that we barely ahve any cap room to play with?
**sorry for the spelling this keyboard is ridiculous**
March 23rd, 2007 at 1:50 pm
I would have to think Scott’s agent is out-pricing him. Since the Giants and Scott had come to a deal before his agent talked him out of it I’d have to think the longer he goes without a deal the better of a chance he has to come back. I’ll tell you what, if Reese somehow signs Leach, trades for Wilson and gets Scott to come back for his deal my outlook on this season is all of a sudden much more bright! Although its been frustrating to watch Reese has put us in a good position without extending us financialy.
March 23rd, 2007 at 2:01 pm
Hazin -
Alright, I don’t have time to read all the previous comments so I don’t know if you answered this. What about Wilson’s injuries. His Neck, Back and Thumb. I’m now in favor of him but am concerned about injuries.
March 23rd, 2007 at 2:01 pm
Sorry Hazem
March 23rd, 2007 at 2:02 pm
Carm the report was eronious. The person who reported screwed up his math. He alotted something like 5 or 6 million to sign draft picks when you only need to put aside 2 million. Also I don’t think the Giants would be the front runner in trade talks for a player they couldn’t afford to put on the pay roll.
March 23rd, 2007 at 2:04 pm
Rick-His injuries have never stopped him from playing. He’s never played in less than 15 games in any of his 9 years in the NFL. He had surgery on his thumbs this offseason and thats why he sat out of the ProBowl. If his thumbs are his biggest problem he would be great for our team.
March 23rd, 2007 at 2:11 pm
Oh we can calm down a little about the Eagles. I guess NFL network said that the lions and Eagles have recently talked about trading for him. That doesn’t exactly sound like they are that determined to get him.
March 23rd, 2007 at 2:11 pm
Is the trade for Wilson really a done deal? Here it says Wilson is in NY taking a physical and if he passes the deal is practically done. Any truth to this???
http://www.denverpost.com/ci_5505017
March 23rd, 2007 at 2:13 pm
I sure as shit hope so!!!
March 23rd, 2007 at 2:32 pm
Okay, I’m convinced. Let’s do it!
March 23rd, 2007 at 2:39 pm
The Broncos Pro Bowl linebacker is in New York taking his physical today, an indication his trade to the Giants is imminent.
A source close to Wilson confirmed he is in New York, and if he passes his physical, a trade could be announced later this afternoon.
March 23rd, 2007 at 3:25 pm
http://blog.nj.com/ledgergiants/
“According to someone familiar with the trade talks, the potential deal for LB Al Wilson isn’t going to happen. Details still soming in.
Sorry to burst your bubble, but all I said was that Wilson was in New York for a physical. Maybe the Giants saw something they didn’t like.
MG”
March 23rd, 2007 at 4:05 pm
well, which is it? are we getting him or what?… hazem or dan save us! lol
March 23rd, 2007 at 11:30 pm
Steve’s link said right in it the deal hit a snag. It said the deal would have been done but they saw something they didnt like. That might be a good way to get him cheaper actually. Otherwise they might just walk away.
March 26th, 2007 at 3:33 am
giants have done good with 4th round picks i would go for wilson and that’s it. remember most early rounders are flops i expect reese to do the right thing our schedual will be weeker than last year our core players are in place i would draft lb first round, corner second reciever 3rd and o line fourth. giants always pick up good picks in the late rounds. don’t stress we’ll be ok
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